Leadership / 06.29.23
From Dodgers Stadium to Olympic Venues — How an Accountant Became a Ticketing Legend
Christine Payne
Debra Kay Duncan's legendary status reaches Olympic proportions, both figuratively and literally. In addition to her role as Director of Ticketing for the MLB’s famed Los Angeles Dodgers for 13 years, she was involved in a dozen Olympic Games since 1984. Oddly, Debra never intended to work in ticketing per se.
“I had always been a big Dodgers fan and wanted to work close to them,” she says. “I graduated in accounting. I am a CPA, and so when I interviewed for my job out of college, I really wanted to go to work for what is now Ernst & Young because I knew they audited the Dodgers out of their Los Angeles office. I didn't get my first offer from that office. I got it from San Francisco, and it is a long story, but I eventually, through quite a bit of nudging and perseverance, got the offer from LA.”
Debra continues, “I wasn’t on the Dodgers audit at first, but I managed to nudge my way onto that account as well. Back in the ‘70s, ticketing was a huge revenue source for professional teams. Sponsorships hadn't taken off like today, and signage and suites, none of that existed. We had to audit ticketing quite thoroughly, hard tickets, deadwood, just all sorts of things that are no longer a big deal in our industry. So, that is when I got my toe dipped in the ticketing waters. I was an accountant auditing the Dodgers.”
It was the beginning of a fortuitous ticketing career, says Debra, something she fell into by chance, but which turned out to be “very rewarding.”
“I don't think I would have enjoyed it as much if I had chosen to stay in that CPA role as an accountant,” she says. “It was actually a great background to have when you are in ticketing. Lots of controls and numbers are required in both fields to do it right. But, certainly, I would not have had the opportunities, the excitement, and the rewards that I have had. And I have always felt really good that my family was able to enjoy the jobs that I had. My kids have been to countless MLB All Star games, the Olympics and World Series.”
Debra at the World Series with her mom, dad and youngest son, Cory. Debra says the ability to buy tickets to these types of events can be a privilege as a result of working in the industry.
Debra eventually moved on from Ernst & Young, but in the early ‘80s, the firm called her out of the blue to see if she would be interested in taking on a new assignment.
“Ernst & Young was contracted to build the Los Angeles Olympics ticketing system, and on behalf of the organizing committee they asked if I would be interested to come onboard as the first ticketing employee for the Games,” Debra says. “I was a little bit worried about taking a job that only had a two-year lifespan, but I did, and it started quite a career path for me in the ticketing industry.”
That is most definitely an understatement. Debra was part of a team that helped make the 1984 Summer Olympics a thundering success at a time when many thought it would be impossible.
“We took on a Games that was almost impossible to handle after Montreal had just lost a ton of money in 1976,” she says. “Nobody even bid on the games except LA and Iran, and Iran had just had the hostage crisis, so they were not getting it. Our bid would never pass muster today because nothing was guaranteed. The city, the government, the USOPC (United States Olympic & Paralympic Committee) didn’t guarantee anything or provide any funding. We were privately funded. Nobody was going to help us. So, we went into it with our fingers crossed.”
Debra says, “Peter Ueberroth was an incredible leader, but we did not know how it would turn out until the end. As a matter of fact, on May 8, 1984, the Russians boycotted the Games, and took with them most of the Eastern Bloc countries. That could have been a disaster, but fortunately, ABC, who had the right to pull out of [broadcasting] … did not pull out, and China, which had not been to a Games in a long time, joined in. Finally, the U.S. and the local people here in LA got behind us … It went off beautifully. I would like us to all take credit for that, but we were truly blessed, had good leadership, and things just worked out for us. This, to me, changed the Olympic movement. The model of the Los Angeles Olympic Games, in a lot of ways, is still followed today. Even the philosophy of the ticketing system has been followed in part by almost every Olympics since.”
Debra continues, “One of the legacies of those Games started in the ticketing department when we created a program called the Olympic Patron Program. It was designed to attract folks who would pay a lot for good seats. We packaged two tickets to two events a day — the best seats in the house. It included other perks as well. It sold for $25,000. The difference between the face value of the tickets and the $25,000 went to buy tickets for kids who otherwise would not be able to attend the Games. We established a 501c3, which is now called the LA84 Foundation, so the patrons would be able to receive a partial tax write-off. This Foundation eventually became the recipient of a portion of the surplus that the Games generated, $93,000,000, and has been helping bring sports to communities that do not have the resources to provide sports for kids. The mission of the Foundation is to give kids life skills through sport while at the same time, trying to close the play equity gap. This Foundation has distributed a quarter of a billion dollars since its inception and has a solid endowment to keep it going." Debra has been on the board for many years and just completed her term as their first female chair. She says it is one of the most rewarding things she has ever done.
Debra’s involvement with the Olympics continued for many years. In 1988, she went to Calgary to pick up the pieces after an unfortunate scandal with their ticketing director. She became the General Manager of the ticketing department. Debra has many fond memories of Calgary. Among them, she remembers frequent visits from her future husband, Wayne. “He would come up and see me all the time and bring me roses,” she reminisces. “It was really hard work in Calgary as I arrived so late. I started just a year before Games time, and we had a lot of work to do. But, as it goes in ticketing, I made lifelong friendships as a result of people working together on such a great project.
Sample ticket for the Calgary Olympics. Henry was Debra’s name before she married Wayne Duncan.
When that was over, Debra returned to Los Angeles and worked for a company that did the ticketing in the United States for Albertville, Barcelona and Lillehammer. Debra says, “It was a great experience to stay connected. I was able to consult independently with Albertville and Lillehammer as well. I loved it.”
Debra kept in touch with the Dodgers throughout her years working the Olympics. Then a job combining her passion for the ball club and ticketing experience opened up in 1991.
“They were looking [for a ticketing director], and Bob Graziano, who I knew from when we worked on the Olympics together, was their president. I applied for the job and got it. I worked for Walter Nash [who was Director of Ticketing for the Dodgers] for a few years before he retired. He was a ticketing legend and also a member of INTIX. Under his direction, Ernst & Young designed a ticketing system for the Dodgers that vaguely resembled what we had at the Olympics. Walter was a pioneer, and that system lived for many, many years. We even installed it at the Angels, Mets and Tigers. I learned so much over that period of time. “
Debra also learned from ticketing colleagues outside of the Dodgers, who would become lifelong friends. “I met Russ Stanley [who works in ticketing for the San Francisco Giants] when he was just cutting his teeth in the industry. Arthur Schultze was his boss at the Giants and another ticketing legend. Arthur retired. Russ inherited the department when he was just a cute kid. So, Walter Nash and I talked to him a lot about what we did at the Dodgers and how it might help him. We are still very good friends today. When people talk about the Dodger/Giant rivalry, I always say — not in ticketing!”
While at the Dodgers, Debra was also able to consult with the Olympic organizing committees from Atlanta, Sydney and Salt Lake City. She actually brought her family to the Games in Atlanta, and for the first time, enjoyed them as a spectator.
Debra retired from the Dodgers in 2004 but still kept her contacts with the Olympics. For the Winter Olympics in 2006 in Torino, she worked for the Olympic Family Ticket Office. Because it was over six weeks, she decided to bring her mom, Wayne and the kids. The kids were thrilled because they missed school, but as Debra recalls, it was an opportunity of a lifetime for all of them. It was a different ticketing system than she was used to, “but it all worked out just fine. Another great memory,” she says.
Debra with Wayne and the kids, Cory and Nico, at a USA Olympic hockey game at the 2006 Olympics in Torino.
Debra had planned to retire when she left the Dodgers, but then she heard from the University of Southern California (USC).
“I got this call from a good friend of mine. His name is Ron Orr. He was an assistant athletic director [at USC]. We had met at the 1984 Olympics and stayed friends. He called and said, ‘They really need a ticketing director here. It has gotten bigger than the people they have. Would you be interested?’ If you live in LA, USC and UCLA, those are really revered organizations. I couldn’t say no,” Debra says.
So, Debra heeded the call and was hired as the Ticket Director. “We made a lot of changes in the [six] years that I was there … I got re-engaged with all my ticketing friends, but coming at it from a different perspective, which was university ticketing. We had just built a new venue. Of course, we did all the sports stuff, but we also did theatre, and special events like the Dalai Lama. It was different for me and a lot of fun. I had a great staff.”
Debra’s USC Trojan.
While Debra was with USC, she was able to take time off to work up in Vancouver for the Winter Games in 2010. She recalls a short but great experience running the Olympic Family Ticket Office once again. She was still loving the Olympics and loved being a part of putting them on.
In 2012, it was time to move on from USC. Debra says, “Sometimes I think I still would be at USC, but a job offer from the Dan Murphy Foundation (DMF) came along, and I thought, this touches a whole different part of me about giving back. I liked that, so I thought I would give it a whirl. It wasn't ticketing for the first time in a long time, but it was about funding mostly Catholic organizations, mostly in education, secondary education, so it helped me to learn more about foundation work. It felt good in a different way.”
Debra says, “I loved getting involved with other foundations, the Archdiocese of Los Angeles, Catholic high schools, and working with so many good people trying to make a difference in our corner of the world,” Debra says. “It connected so well with some of the volunteer work I was doing. It just fit together nicely.”
She continues, “I did miss my ticketing world, though, so I was eager to jump at the opportunity to work the Games in London during the summer of 2012.”
Debra’s last Games was the Olympic Games in 2012 in London. While her kids did not make that trip across the pond, her mom and sister did. And Debra enjoyed every minute of it despite the hard work. “[Working the Olympics] really kicks your butt, especially when you are working just game time, which I was [in London]. It was three weeks of [working] nonstop. I came home exhausted and thought I would love to watch the next Olympics on TV. And I have, ever since! But it’s a great story, and it has been a great experience. And I truly have enjoyed every minute of it.”
2012 Olympic pin from London.
Debra retired from the Dan Murphy Foundation in 2018, but she has not retired from INTIX or the friends and colleagues she has met over the years. She feels so blessed to have had the career she has had.
Keeping in touch with colleagues and friends she has made along the way came up several times during Debra’s interview. It is clear she has always believed in people, in supporting each other and in creating bonds. “In ticketing, you work a lot of hours and a lot of weekends. You are away from your family much of the time. Sometimes it is a thankless job. It is so behind the scenes. If anything, you hear the problems people have more than anything else. And I know, especially in my earlier days, it seemed like the marketing folks got all the swag and fun things, and you are in the background just trying to keep it together.”
She says, “I hope that one of the best things I created wherever I worked was a good environment. My special memories about the places I have worked really have to do with the people and coming together to work hard and create a really good product.”
Some of the memories are very, very special, she says. Debra recalls fondly her time with the Dodgers. During her tenure, the Dodgers were still in the hands of the O’Malley family. That created an atmosphere where everybody felt they truly belonged.
“I had the greatest job in the city,” Debra says. “I just loved being there, and we all loved it. Don't get me wrong, I was a huge baseball fan, but that almost becomes incidental when you are working so hard. I had two boys, so they came to all the games. They grew up there and were embraced by everybody. The announcers, Vin Scully, those guys, they knew your kids. It was that kind of a place.”
She says, “I tell my husband, ‘We’ve got to keep our karma clean because we are so blessed.’ I don't want to screw anything up … I have always loved the people I've worked with. I mostly work at my church now or the Archdiocese or LA84 Foundation. It feels good. But I look back so fondly on the wonderful jobs and experiences this wonderful industry of ticketing afforded me.”
Debra has been an active member of INTIX since her days with the Dodgers. She served on the board, as Board Chair, and in 2007 was honored with the Patricia G. Spira Lifetime Achievement Award. Debra has many fond INTIX memories beginning with the 1995 conference in San Diego, where she recalls “it rained the whole time.”
Debra accepting the Patricia G. Spira Lifetime Achievement Award.
“The people I met then are the same people and more who I know today,” she says. “It is that kind of organization. We had a conference here in Hollywood, and Dave Lowenstein was the chair. That was a great experience for me to be on that committee because I got to know so many people in ticketing in the LA area better. I believe networking is so important, and people in INTIX give of everything they have; whatever they can do to help you, their intellect, their experience, they share it.”
Debra, fifth from right, poses with other Patricia G. Spira Lifetime Achievement Award recipients, at INTIX 2020 in New York City.
Indeed, INTIX and ticketing are all about relationships and sharing, says Debra. And over her career, she has given back in other ways too. Back in 2013, a group of INTIX women lifetime achievement recipients did an INTIX workshop about finding a balance between life and work and other life lessons learned. It proved so popular that there was great interest from other ladies to find a way to continue the conversation. Four of them created the Women in Ticketing Facebook group after that conference, and it has continued to grow and change. During COVID, alongside the original group of ladies, Jennifer Staats Moore, Maureen Andersen and Karen Sullivan, Debra attended weekly calls for women struggling because they had lost their jobs or were not working. “That [Women in Ticketing call] lasted for three years because that's what we do,” Debra says. “The whole thing is about learning from each other, being there for each other when you need [someone] and celebrating.”
Debra poses with some “lady lifers,” other Patricia G. Spira Lifetime Achievement Award recipients, at INTIX 2020 in New York City. L-R: Linda Forlini, Jennifer Staats Moore, Maureen Andersen, Debra and Jane Kleinberger.
Undoubtedly, Debra’s journey from accounting to ticketing and everything that went on between and after has been rewarding and memorable. But what is she most proud of?
“I will take one area at a time,” she says. “Working on the Olympics in Los Angeles in 1984 is one of the proudest things I have done. That we were able to work together and pull that together, I feel very proud that I was very involved in that. At the Dodgers, we went through many changes, but I am very proud of what we created as a department and loved the team and all we experienced together. The gentleman who runs that ticketing office now, Seth Bluman, is still a friend of mine. I hired him over 25 years ago to answer phones for us in customer service. I am very proud and honored to know the people who have crossed my path. And certainly, with the LA84 Foundation, that organization has changed the lives of so many kids. I’m so happy to be a small part of it.”
As proud as Debra may be of her many achievements, we wondered if she could go back and do it all again, would she change anything?
‘No, I wouldn't,” she says without hesitating. “I often wonder about things, though, but I wouldn't do them differently. I had an opportunity to leave the Dodgers and go work for the Atlanta Olympic Games. We had my oldest son, who was maybe three years old, and I was pregnant. Sometimes I wonder what would have happened had I chosen to go work there. A friend who worked for me in Calgary — I got her a job in Lillehammer and then in Atlanta — continued to work the Olympics until Rio. So, that could have been a career path for me. Every once in a while, especially when I'm at the Games, I see these folks who have made the Olympics their career, and you know how cool it is, and I wonder what I would be doing. But I think personally, having a family and trying to do the Olympics is just [tough] … So, I'm curious [about what might have been], but I wouldn't change anything.”
And finally, having gained Olympian wisdom during a long and remarkable career, we asked what advice she might have for others in the ticketing industry. “Never be afraid to pick up a phone and reach out … I cannot take credit for anything I have done. It is because of the people I know,” she says modestly. “That would be my biggest piece of advice.”
Debra continues, “If you are fortunate enough to be in a management position, listen to your people, create a warm environment, but also make it fun. We all have to work, so let’s try to have a good time.”
In closing, we asked Debra if there was anything we had missed. “I would say, don't ever stop following your dreams. That one day that I showed up in the LA office at Ernst & Young to change my offer from San Francisco to Los Angeles changed the trajectory of my whole career. Do not ever underestimate that your dreams aren't worth fighting for.”
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Tags: Leadership , Ticketing Legends